Encephalograph

Аюрведа · Post by **Аюрведа** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:51

Valery
Thank you.

Тапка · Post by **Тапка** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 3:52

Valery , Doppler , of ANAS - have you Heard anything about Nanobelt ???
http://neurobotics.ru/downloads/Neurobo ... t_2009.pdf page 8 , wireless 4-channel EEG . About 30 thousand rubles .
Worth it to buy??? ( if moderators deem is the link I remove , simple anywhere except price there are no descriptions of it )

Валерий Михайлович · Post by **Валерий Михайлович** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:14

SW. Sneaker,
information on this device do not have. If you learn something from the manufacturer, lay out here will help with the assessment.
In my opinion, the best option is to purchase equipment emotiv. As I understand it, there design is so perfect that you are not even chloromelanite electrodes with gel-layer, and ordinary stainless steel. 300.e for such a device - a ridiculous price. There's kit (SDK) for constructing applications of EEG biofeedback and implementation. The trouble is that all English, and I did not speak the language. If I lived in the capital region, certainly organized a group of like-minded people, which includes developers who know my language, and an SDK you can buy a purse

Тапка · Post by **Тапка** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:38

Okay, the manufacturer sent me the user manual - I will look.

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Thu Mar 03, 2011 21:22

Тапка wrote:Valery , Doppler , of ANAS - have you Heard anything about Nanobelt ???
http://neurobotics.ru/downloads/Neurobo ... t_2009.pdf page 8 , wireless 4-channel EEG . About 30 thousand rubles .

Sneaker, respect, an interesting device - the description here: http://neurobotics.ru/products/neurobelt/

IMHO we must take without hesitation - I don't see the price real. If to speak about serious EEG, some sort of budget Bialy (about 100 sput) I didn't find. Google.

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Thu Mar 03, 2011 21:40

After - apparently Nanobelt again, not galvanically isolated (hardly her voracio in such a small and cheap device). I mean, sure someone will come to a head simultaneously record EEG and recharge the device. (As we do sometimes, to put it charging a cell phone). Sooner or later, after Murphy well, someone in it will electrocute himself right in the head, from the outlet through the electrodes

Alternatively, it is possible charging is conducted through the same socket where the ribbon cable connects the electrodes. Then either the electrodes or the power. In the first version of ANAS we generally removed the UI to prevent patient contact with the plug, even theoretically. Otherwise the device is potentially dangerous and it will fail to certify.

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Thu Mar 03, 2011 21:52

Well, after my LJ http://neuro-amea.livejournal.com

Тапка · Post by **Тапка** » Fri Mar 04, 2011 0:58

Thank you, ANAS , cheaper nanobelt I nezahodil and there is hardly . And radio into the bargain, and 4 electrodes , for home studies should be enough))

And for recharging - maybe there is a tricky system - stuck the charger , the system only charges the battery not working .

I have so elektrotvarka . Or stick headphones and the sound on them is translated,the speakers are cut mechanically and pereklyuchenii happens.

Тапка · Post by **Тапка** » Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:03

Of ANAS you is also very interesting device , instead of schedules it shows the activity of various parts of the brain very clearly .

Валерий Михайлович · Post by **Валерий Михайлович** » Fri Mar 04, 2011 11:46

SW. Sneaker,
regarding the links of ANAS on the documentation Nanobelt can say the following:
apparently at the entrance there are instrumentation amplifiers that, coupled with galvanic isolation channel and battery powered can provide excellent suppression of common-mode interference, provided good balancing of the input circuits.
However, it is worrying the manufacturer specification: the range of the DC input +-30mkv!
The fact that the skin surface of the skull "walk" potentials up to hundreds of mV. Even a pair of silver chloride electrodes is the polarization potential difference of a few mV! For automatic compensation of the DC component, are able to cause the amplifier to saturate at the entrance put the capacitors. But then the manufacturer has to specify the lower boundary of the frequency range! Moreover, these capacitors must be of decent quality and, therefore, of considerable size, which I saw on pictures of the PCB.
The composition suggests that the device is "focused" on the analysis of alpha rhythms. While meditative techniques that paranormal phenomena are usually correlated with the theta and lower frequency rhythms.
T. O. can say only one thing - the device most likely has sufficient noise immunity for use in the home. The rest is covered in darkness - not enough information.

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Sat Mar 05, 2011 17:34

Valery, I'm just trying to explain to the forum that the study of slow and infraslow activity

a) much easier
b) informative
g) budget

the registration of high-frequency EEG (especially for a person far from a clinical diagnosis). That's why we created the ANAS.

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Sat Mar 05, 2011 17:39

Тапка wrote:And for recharging - maybe there is a tricky system - stuck the charger , the system only charges the battery not working .
I have so elektrotvarka . Or stick headphones and the sound on them is translated,the speakers are cut mechanically and pereklyuchenii happens.

Sorry, still not rolling - electrical circuit still exists with a static discharge there is a break in the head. GOST is necessary to keep the breakdown voltage 4.5 kV

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Sat Mar 05, 2011 17:49

Тапка wrote:of ANAS you is also very interesting device , instead of schedules it shows the activity of various parts of the brain very clearly .

Well, why do graphics activity in time, we also build. Neuroanesthesiology NEK does it automatically, synchronously with the construction of 2D maps of the brain in its own software, but of ANAS allows you to do it in supplied. Just NEK runs concurrently with the 5-th or 12-th electrodes, and of ANAS with 1 or 2.

It is also EEG, only verhotina (SCP - 0-1 Hz), reflecting the tensions of biochemical processes in different areas of the brain. Naturally, this activity correlates with the rapid EEG - for example, raising the UPP is accompanied by suppression of alpha rhythm. Foreign authors called this technique the DC-EEG, that is, "EEG DC"

Валерий Михайлович · Post by **Валерий Михайлович** » Sat Mar 05, 2011 22:03

SW. Of ANAS, I am familiar with the studies slow activity of the monograph V. A. Illinoi "Slow electrical processes of the human brain" and the corresponding hardware register map for edition: Mishin. Infra-low frequency amplifiers Bonaparte with galvanic separation of input and output. Energoatomizdat, 1983. If you are not familiar with the work Mishina, highly recommend - only there clearly set out the theory of biosilica. The recording of MEP has never worked, because of MEP activity is not suitable for the implementation of BOS at its core. However, Express doubt that the channel check-MEP easier standard channel encephalograph. As I understand it, You use UPT. It must be made absolutely fantastic demand on account of the zero drift. Does Your device register E wave waiting for Walter? What is its frequency range?
Ilyukhin leads requirements for this amplifier: drift 5-20mkv\h, Rin. current is less than 1na, the developed system of compensation and gain control, constant coef-t amplification in the range 0-1000Hz, the suppression of common mode noise to noise(not to exceed 10mkv, shown to the door)

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:13

Valery, since the publication of classic works Aladzhalova, Illinoi etc. flowed a lot of water is a modern idea of infraslow activity is in the microvolt range recorded potentials of neuronal origin, in millivolt - nineronline potentials (GSR, vascular and BBB). Here is the GSR-and it is not suitable for bare, as connected with the vegetative functions of the body. Potentials arising "secondary" on the walls of the vessels and membranes of the BBB purely cerebral origin, and they very accurately describe the state of the nervous tissue, as a large population of neurons. And that one is for barefoot - the most IT!

For the registration of these potentials (SCP) is used of specialized UPT, and requirements for zero drift and the noise he determined by resolution of the method (1 mV). The device is not very tricky, but if done incorrectly - You will be registered omega-potential instead of the soft starter. On modern amplifiers microvolt potentials at the present time more than all know the Finns (P. Tallgren et al., do a Google search.)

E-wave still is in the microvolt range, and our equipment is "directly" it does not "see", except that the simultaneous activity of large populations of pyramidal cells can move AAR in the tissues of the frontal cortex. Something similar we see with the method NEK/of ANAS, when the oscillations of strong-willed efforts clearly cause an increase in SCP amplitude in the 1-15 mV. Only this "secondary" metabolic "electricity", unlike "primary", prishedshego directly from the membranes of neurons.

In short, You, as the expert, certainly will be interesting to take a new look at the phenomenon of MEP. I assure you, everything changed...

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:15

Валерий Михайлович wrote: What is its frequency range?

0-1 Hz.

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:19

Валерий Михайлович wrote: However, Express doubt that the channel check-MEP easier standard channel encephalograph.

It is not the complexity of the channel, and the simplicity (or rather availability) analysis and understanding of the recorded phenomenon of SCP in the millivolt range. UPP higher - brain activity is higher and Vice versa. (Well..... slightly simplified, of course

)

Валерий Михайлович · Post by **Валерий Михайлович** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 17:41

SW. Of ANAS when I expressed doubt about the applicability of the analysis of MEP for barefoot, I mean large temporary permanent processes. If the process takes tens of seconds, I think that it is difficult to implement a control action. Is that to analyze derivatives, but the function is unlikely to have a smooth character.
If You don't mind, please give references to scientific papers in this area, especially about the correlates of check MEP millivoltage range with the functions of the higher nervous activity.

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 18:29

I recommend to start to get acquainted with the works of V. F. Fokin (NC neurology of the Russian Academy of medical Sciences). http://neuroenergetic.narod.ru/archiv/BOOK.rar

Well then, a lot of work on the method here: http://cerebral-asymmetry.narod.ru/

If You are an expert in bare - don't you want to talk on the possibilities of the method NEK? Maybe we'll think of something collaborative and useful?

АМЕА · Post by **АМЕА** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 18:37

My opinion on the barefoot with the use of SCP is often recorded potentials far exceed the physiological norm (logged oxidative stress). And the situation is very stable and can remain unchanged for hours, days and weeks. About the dangers of free radical processes enough said. So with the help of the SCP analysis, we can register the stress state and using the reverse of Savi to choose methods of normalization UPP with subsequent fixation achieved.

Валерий Михайлович · Post by **Валерий Михайлович** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:03

SW. Of ANAS, thank you for the links. It takes time to sort out. To my knowledge, alas, was frozen at the beginning of the 90s.

сарматъ · Post by **сарматъ** » Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:15

so has anyone collected EEG?

сарматъ · Post by **сарматъ** » Sun Nov 25, 2012 15:39

apparently not.. but the Doppler still on the forum?

Антоники · Post by **Антоники** » Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:44

Dialect where are you?
What are your latest achievements in the field of understanding how the brain works or the management of its development? It was very interesting to read you. And what about St. Petersburg-the Norwegian scientist today ?

Триалект · Post by **Триалект** » Mon May 13, 2013 1:14

Hello again.
Thank you for the compliment, flattered. I apologize for the long breaks. I am ashamed to say, elementary laziness coupled with online games seduced me with the way eageseg. In the interval there was a fascination with kung - ladies and gentlemen, it is a powerful thing, I can only advise. Only here you will have opportunities everyday for an hour and a half, and so the rest of your life. But the effect is stunning.
However, I wanted to write about neurofeedback. After my essercizii two or three years ago I ran out of money and all I was doing everyday issues. But there is a serious problem of regular headaches, usually on the weather, or from fatigue. At first I did not pay attention, then sat down on analgin, until I finally realized that it can't continue. The attacks were repeated two times per week and lasted up to a day, if you do not take analgesics. About a year ago I went to a neuro-surgical clinic and underwent a full testing program of the brain to physiological problems.
None have been identified.
Actually, it was a positive, because if it turned out that I had organic changes in the brain, it would be quite fun. On the other hand, because the cause of pain were not found, except for analgesics, no one I could not offer.
Then I went to the experts for neurofeedback. This time I went to a certain Frau Wiedemann (Wiedemann) in Stuttgart. This woman is a follower of the tübingen school of Ottarov. With me it began with ultra-low frequencies and special effects to no avail. That is, I am nothing "this" did not feel and said I wanted something "such". Well, that is, explained that rather looking at neurofeedback a kind of "helicopter on Everest", the acceleration effect of meditation, fast enlightenment, and before him - a clear mental sensation of presence "here and now". Of course, tell you about their previous search sessions with Vasanthi, with Klein, they're all each other well know.
After the low frequencies we switched to normal. And then it began. We tried different combinations, single and dual training, then beta, then alpha theta, coherent and feelings were varied. After alpha-theta I barely got home - it was impossible to concentrate on driving. I was entirely self-absorbed. After beta disappeared the need for sleep (and the training was in the evenings), instead of the usual 22 hours I managed to fall asleep somewhere around 4 am. Was different different feeling, change of attitude, which is very hard to describe. I just saw the world differently than usual.
But most importantly, the brain has learned to cope with the headaches.
I had three or four such moment when I felt that here-here will begin the attack. The head was dragged heavily, the skull seemed to split into pieces. And after 20 to 30 minutes, this condition is passed by itself. Full attack for all these eighteen months have passed since the resumption of training, never happened to me even once.
Today we went for a month and a half sessions 11. For long-term changes in the perception of the need at least twenty. But I, first, problems with time - the new job requires constant travel. Second, each session costs me 85 euros, and I'm an employee, albeit German.
In General, while I have another forced break. But not for long, somewhere to fall. On the other hand, Frau Wiedemann itself suggested me to use your Atlantis home, and promised to be suitable for me protocols.
In General, I want to say that in the right hands neurofeedback is a very powerful thing. But I, in my opinion, have something to write here.
Antonica about Kropotova know nothing, I definitely can not afford. Participation in three-day workshops is more than 2000 Eurosec. But the seminars he offers, that I know. About a month ago, I received another invitation to one of these workshops.<

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