bomb - publication by the OS

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bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Mon May 12, 2014 22:38

That's kind of dear magazine
http://www.nature.com/neuro/journal/vao ... .3719.html
conducted a study, which initiated the OS using electrocutaneous (transcranial) stimulation.
Hard to believe but is my personal opinion, as someone working in the field of sleep medicine and in his vreya a lot of experimenting with rhythmic stimulation of the OS...
The fact that such studies are already punched in the logs is in itself highly commendable... Actually, the Germans last time, judging by the publications, something is seriously interested in rhythmic stimulation. From which a wave, who knows?

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Mon May 12, 2014 22:43

Here is a link to a Russian link to the study
http://www.gazeta.ru/science/2014/05/12_a_6027085.shtml

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by ЛИЛИЯ-Р » Tue May 13, 2014 15:40

I guess no matter what you enter sleep mode half asleep , even with a feather tickling in the nose , the main thing is not to Wake up completely. People are sensitive sleepers, often in women in the period when there are little children and need constant monitoring , more frequent Wasps .By the way noted that during the transportation (train , airplane) Wasps more often because not everyone can sleep there. I am also in metro , North metro and Presnov, and easy))))) they happen more often, although you can argue that it's Wasps, but in them I can do something that can't just sleep. And easier than in Wasps in bed.
That's just not very desirable to me in my sleep zapped, even small)))) Then just probably my mind will not go to sleep .

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by к-13 » Tue May 13, 2014 19:04

5 years ago I read the same article, only the stimulation was light and sound, and frequencies are indicated 22 and 40 Hz. At these frequencies, almost all of the OOBE-sessions built - in Delta-stage 4, have clear "beyond being" from three files on these frequencies is (just another 61Гц added). The results of their use is not as optimistic as the results of their research...
ЛИЛИЯ-Р wrote:That's just not very desirable to me in my sleep zapped, even small)))) Then just probably my mind will not go to sleep .
Still say that was not slept under Alfario))) Personally, I'm under CES much better sleep. And if you remember the unforgettable "electrosleep" (healing way, a device, Soviet sanatoriums were standing), then your mind will not agree with you. You should try on David or Mirage to check.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by ЛИЛИЯ-Р » Wed May 14, 2014 14:02

ЛИЛИЯ-Р wrote:That's just not very desirable to me in my sleep zapped, even small)))) Then just probably my mind will not go to sleep .
Still say that was not slept under Alfario))) Personally, I'm under CES much better sleep. And if you remember the unforgettable "electrosleep" (healing way, a device, Soviet sanatoriums were standing), then your mind will not agree with you. You should try on David or Mirage to check.[/quote]

I have not used ALTARIA as sleep))). I now sleep like a log lately. Just now the more needful in poluprovodniki(in OSA) and remembering a dream.Rather it is in the remembering. Tried to say the dream still half asleep ie in OSA, how it seemed to me that he was then, laughed for a long time. Bredyatina meowing))))difficult to Understand what it says there. And after waking up once everything is erased, only the picture.
Roma , you're right))), about electric forgot. By the way there as Alfario , if it is to pick a comfortable level ... Although many said in the office(and why it is not written on the forum) that when using Alfaria on the ultimate stimulation for them in a couple of hours, there comes a state when you really want to sleep and dream calm and deep.
Try to accomplish your goal then on their devices.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Thu May 15, 2014 13:52

5 Years ago I read the same article, only the stimulation was light and sound
Link remember?

By the way. Here's a link to more modern developments in the field of tactile stimulation. The modern successor to electrosleep. This is the theme I am doing.
http://www.neurocom.ru/pdf/press/volgograd.pdf

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Fri May 16, 2014 0:11

In General, I read this article.
http://www.nature.com/neuro/journal/vao ... .3719.html (full version)
I have this study of trust special does not cause. In any case, it is not necessary to study phenomenon called Lucid dreaming. At least because they used psychological scale for the assessment of awareness in a dream, and not a direct test eyes as Laberge.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by к-13 » Fri May 16, 2014 1:38

Дмитрий__ wrote:Link remember?
I have this great interest - not hunting again to shovel the Internet, honestly))) I Remember reading in the English speaking Internet material to stimulate lucid dreams with the filing of the relevant session in the BWG and came across a reference to the "astral projection frequencies" - the 22 and 40 Hz. Then searched in Google for tags "OOBE brainwave research", and somewhere in the results I read about conducted in the last century of research in which the subjects after immersion in a deep sleep alternately fed into one ear and eye a frequency of 22 Hertz and 40 Hertz, alternated this joy between the two halves of the listener every few seconds and shook it. After awakening, subjects have reported colorful and intense dreams, most refining understanding that in that moment they were in a dream. The article is of course not exactly the same but are very similar and in detail, and in the absence of real impact review. I then dozens of such sessions made up and my results were much more modest described - I thought that if I fell asleep on the couch in the laboratory in order to conduct this experiment, I could be any frequencies beeping and blinking the sleep - in any case, it would be bright and related to the object of study, that is, with the element of awareness, though, pseudo.

And I Linkova SP with the addition of fluorite and filed it through the reinforced coil these same frequencies during sleep (not just their own) - there are also isolated cases, statistics are normally more often, than from reading relevant literature.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Алега » Fri May 16, 2014 3:08

And I have a few days yuzayu http://psi-technology.net/tov_op/upravlenie_snom.php have on the public.Effect of early dreams didn't remember,and after the program often began to remember the day or first thing in the morning.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Fri May 16, 2014 11:10

And I have a few days yuzayu
Well poyuzat another 2 weeks, collect the statistics. Then report back. Honestly 8)
This technological miracle would be a miracle 15 years ago... how can the crumbs from the cake to pick up...

K-13 Roman, apparently, the level of those studies is even lower than in the above-mentioned publication. Me personally in addition to "test Laberge" nothing else convinces. Besides, it was hardly a serious magazine.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by к-13 » Fri May 16, 2014 14:10

Дмитрий__ wrote:K-13 a novel, apparently, the level of those studies is even lower than in the above-mentioned publication. Me personally in addition to "test Laberge" nothing else convinces. Besides, it was hardly a serious magazine.
I agree. But this "bomb - publication by the OS" something like rot in the ravine unexploded ordnance from the second world war...

And talking about reliability in one case as something serious.
http://yadi.sk/d/pbbIYCrzDuuqT - for example, one of the files on these frequencies (better to use the deferred method a half hour before lifting to get up for the alarm, execute file on headphones and continue to sleep) - most of the subjects when first using the dreams were very vivid and saturated, well remembered, had those or other elements of consciousness, but subsequent uses in the same conditions the results are almost tends to zero.

In the evening I will try with electrical stimulation, the session had already written.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by bofara » Fri May 16, 2014 19:56

к-13 wrote:..http://yadi.sk/d/pbbIYCrzDuuqT - for example, one of the files on these frequencies (better to use the deferred method a half hour before lifting to get up for the alarm, execute file on the headphones and continue to sleep
Thank you!

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Алега » Sun May 18, 2014 0:29

Дмитрий__ wrote:Well poyuzat another 2 weeks, collect the statistics. Then report back. Honestly 8)
This technological miracle would be a miracle 15 years ago... how can the crumbs from the cake to pick up...
Share a tip for pie.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by нева » Mon May 19, 2014 12:06

Hello! There is an assumption that DIRECT electrical stimulation of the nervous system, especially brain, even though it is super effective, but much the same and wrong. I mean after repeated use can be easily violated structured synaptic connections in the brain..and the second.. the brain quickly unlearn to make the necessary efforts. There is an assumption that for Osiv (not for medicinal purposes )it is desirable to force to work a brain (not the Mind) alone.
But from the perspective of experimentation probably couldn't have been better. In corrective and therapeutic purposes is also remarkable. In short, when the neurotic brain just went wrong and he bit the roof to adjust it is a Holy thing, but when a healthy mind weak currents flowing out of curiosity to conscious of snovideniya is another :) a little Frankenstein experiments associated..))

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Mon May 19, 2014 22:58

of alak
Give a tip for a pie.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Monroe#Hemi-Sync
I think that a large part of the pie he got... On cassette standing copyright 1988... If you take the software generators, for example, Brainwave Generator 15 years ago already.
PS How's about statistics :?

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It is necessary to understand how to organize such research: the Professor gets a young graduate student that sticks out in lucid dreams (or rather, a manic idea of DAILY lucid dreaming :D ). The Professor says: well, here is a theory put forward by a particular "luminary" of science, what kind of awareness in General, and in the dream, in particular, responsible for example, the frontal lobes. Let's encourage them. Of course, the current, because light and sound you're frontal lobe will not get. And without such a theoretical justification of the research is not just Finance... And if there is a positive result, it will be funded only for 1 year... And gathering material for a thesis... So the theory was confirmed.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Сергейя » Thu May 22, 2014 0:04

comparing acoustic stimulation and electrical stimulation is considered incorrect.

if someone the standards are not made they are investigated, not to mention the incompetence of these neuroscientists. the more gain, the group with no experience of the OS, ask them there to serve what the signs are meaningless without proper experience, would be enough enthusiastic emotional stories.

regarding the weaning of the brain to enter the OS in a natural way: I would like to remind the phenomenon OS just is an unnatural state of the brain, and this is achieved by practices that lead people to the unusual condition. the most important is the experience of being in this state, because the more you are out there, the more the functions of certain parts of the brain are joined (building a neural connection between them) and this state becomes more natural for the brain. because the method of entering into it completely indifferent.

and I would like to make a mark, the stimulation takes place without any explicit human feelings, which could affect the depth of sleep. (if you rely on the data presented in the media)
Last edited by Сергейя on Thu May 22, 2014 1:31, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by к-13 » Thu May 22, 2014 0:35

Дмитрий__ wrote:for awareness in General, and in the dream, in particular, responsible for example, the frontal lobes. Let's encourage them. Of course, the current, because light and sound you're frontal lobe will not get.
Why do I need to limit the means? Electromagnetic stimulation, for example, where the use of directional emitters of low-frequency electro-magnetic fields (one might say, a natural stimulant - arousal in the brain has, along with chemical and electro-magnetic basis, and the currents there is generally a thing extremely specific, having little to do with what is passed through the skin of the skull). And by the way, the coil is correctly wound at home (in my humble opinion) is much simpler than the normal electrode to organize.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Алега » Thu May 22, 2014 0:52

Hey ASSY!!! You would be better suggested something effective for a beginner in the subject.
Dmitry.On account of statistics is better than usual.Before do not remember anything(sooooo sometimes) ,and now after every night there's memories(I'm shocked ).Use the above program+audio Novel in the morning+in the evening are going to add OS Patrushev.Waiting for advice from professionals,something sucked the theme(something for nothing a third of life is-I would like to use).I would be grateful the link to a monolingual forum on the topic.You can PM.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by к-13 » Thu May 22, 2014 1:16

of alakfor a start I can advise to go to the branch grimstalker and read there on the topic of the workshop, it has everything necessary for beginning independent practice (with and without the instrument) I was there gathered.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Thu May 22, 2014 14:16

, Sergei
if someone the standards are not made they are investigated, not to mention the incompetence of these neurophysiologists
About the incompetence of not talking. There in the list of sponsors one of Alan Hobson's worth... we are Talking about an incorrect understanding of this study, a cursory reading. That's what I want to draw attention. Stimulation at the frequency of the gamma rhythm there was not called lucid dreaming. She has raised a rating on a scale of awareness in the survey. Feel the difference?
In addition, there are methodological problems: for example, they measured electrical activity in the brain directly in the process of electrical stimulation. Partly they can understand that during REM-phase followed by further awakening and there's nothing to measure. But to correctly filter out the interference in this case, IMHO, impossible.
K-13
Why do I need to limit the means? Electromagnetic stimulation, for example, where the use of directional emitters of low-frequency electro-magnetic fields
The tool they chose is correct, and the reason , Sergei indicated: in this case, a blind experiment when the subject does not know there is an effect or not. When magnetic stimulation is inevitable characteristic feel and mention the authors of the article, justifying your choice of method of stimulation.
This relatively new method of brain stimulation has no side effects such as acoustic noise and tactile sensations, which are known to accompany transcranial magnetic stimulation and might result in sleep disturbance.

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Thu May 22, 2014 14:24

of alak
Waiting for advice from professionals,something sucked the theme(something for nothing a third of life is-I would like to use).
The frequency of the gamma rhythm of 40 Hz used by the way in the right places (in the alleged periods of REM sleep) "of Course lucid dreaming". And he's 13 years old...

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by к-13 » Thu May 22, 2014 16:03

Дмитрий__ wrote:K-13
Quote:
Why do I need to limit the means? Electromagnetic stimulation, for example, where the use of directional emitters of low-frequency electro-magnetic fields
The tool they chose is correct, and the reason, Sergei pointed out: in this case, a blind experiment when the subject does not know there is an effect or not. When magnetic stimulation is inevitable characteristic feel and mention the authors of the article, justifying your choice of method of stimulation.
Quote:
This relatively new method of brain stimulation has no side effects such as acoustic noise and tactile sensations, which are known to accompany transcranial magnetic stimulation and might result in sleep disturbance.
We seem to say each of his :?

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Thu May 22, 2014 16:57

I'm talking about modern science and its rules of the game - no more... :?

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Сергейя » Mon May 26, 2014 22:34

here is something similar to a Kickstarter aimed)

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Re: bomb - publication by the OS

Post by Дмитрий__ » Mon May 26, 2014 23:46

here is something similar to a Kickstarter aimed)
Well, everything fell into place. If there is demand, there will be a proposal... And I thought - well, why are such studies needed? Will now convert ... must Have time to gather, has not yet published a rebuttal article... :( On the other hand, in medical research a lot of money spent on still more dubious projects.
Interestingly, Laberge reads about all this? :) I think he no longer plays these games.

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